tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4683970826895755480.post3360543164069136027..comments2024-03-28T21:32:26.550+00:00Comments on Bruce Charlton's Notions: What would convince modern people of the divinity of Christ? What would answer their major fears?Bruce Charltonhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/09615189090601688535noreply@blogger.comBlogger7125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4683970826895755480.post-70242985562742009822014-08-03T07:42:12.347+01:002014-08-03T07:42:12.347+01:00@Donald - "But it is somewhat hard to square ...@Donald - "But it is somewhat hard to square with historic teaching and what Jesus says in the gospels."<br /><br />I don't think so - I think it is the obvious interpretation of Christ's words - if you take the message overall and at the common sense level, and do not focus on it as if each detached Biblical verse was supposed to stand alone as a perfect encapsulation. <br /><br />As for historic teaching, that is *extremely* varied - as would be expected. The problem for *any* Christian is how to discern the truth from among the arguments - there is nowhere (no denomination) that the arguments can be escaped and Christianity made uncontroversial. Bruce Charltonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09615189090601688535noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4683970826895755480.post-91717602395725130902014-08-02T21:15:25.879+01:002014-08-02T21:15:25.879+01:00I can't say that I too haven't found some ...I can't say that I too haven't found some corrosive effects.<br /><br />One problem is that I essentially agree with you that people choose post mortem NOT to receive salvation - this seems intuitive, just, loving, etc.<br /><br />But it is somewhat hard to square with historic teaching and what Jesus says in the gospels.<br /><br />Of course historic teaching is not a problem for you - but I don't buy Mormonism or your line of thought - even if I am glad you give me good food for thought/insights.Donaldnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4683970826895755480.post-10703449646949402782014-08-02T19:13:26.339+01:002014-08-02T19:13:26.339+01:00@Donald - Yes, and it is a strange experience to h...@Donald - Yes, and it is a strange experience to hear evangelists first trying to convince people that they are sinners; and only then able to offer the answer (Christ's atonement) to a problem that the person did not previous realize they suffered from!Bruce Charltonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09615189090601688535noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4683970826895755480.post-65182380488688050762014-08-02T19:02:58.525+01:002014-08-02T19:02:58.525+01:00A major problem of modernity is the radical loss o...A major problem of modernity is the radical loss of the sense of sin - it has almost zero purchase. Everyone is a pelagian. <br /><br />I agree 100% these ideas have purchase.Donaldnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4683970826895755480.post-58596552865853190062014-08-02T16:33:51.078+01:002014-08-02T16:33:51.078+01:00@Bill - I think you may be missing the point of th...@Bill - I think you may be missing the point of this argument. Insofar as Christ's claims *were* persuasive, this (maybe) was the kind of way they were persuasive. <br /><br />Of course, Christianity does make incredible claims (in both meanings: beyond credibility, to unbelievers; and astonishingly wonderful, to believers) - it could never be seen as an overwhelmingly probable interpretation. <br /><br />And the point is not to mock or critique peoples fears and desires, but to see that they were different then and now.Bruce Charltonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09615189090601688535noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4683970826895755480.post-57419843805745929142014-08-02T16:11:57.928+01:002014-08-02T16:11:57.928+01:00@TD
I wouldn't write it off so easily. Average...@TD<br />I wouldn't write it off so easily. Average people are capable of staggering narcissism. Everybody is the star of their own movies, and their resentments run deep. <br /><br />Does this not suggest that most are desperate to feel important? And desperation is not born of ignorance or insensibility, whatever else we might say.<br /><br />@Bruce, <br />Are you not overstating the credibility of Christ's claims in the ancient world? Charges of blasphemy and impiety brought Him to the Cross. The only sense in which most found His work intellligible was as a mockery of what was actually sacred and divine. These days, that it is so widely UNintelligible just as the vehicle of our theosis makes it more a mockery of us than it was of them.<br /><br />We do hold something sacred, something by which Christ mocks us in His assurance we need it from Him (and under conditions so absurd): that we can be as Gods. It is just a measure of our debasement that this truest and holiest of desires cashes out in celebrity, tycoonery and caddery instead of something more nobly Miltonic (for apart from Christ, Miltonic it would be).<br /><br />So it seems to me the gravity of just what He does do runs against history and shames the wisdom of the world. God and Satan promise the same thing: what we want. Satan just finds a readier ear.<br /><br /> I should also note at this, if it needs noting, that your list of things modern people fear is all dry tinder for Antichrist. Thinking about what people would want or understand in their gods - what seed would sprout most readily in the bed of history - is the perennial guide for the unscrupulous spirit. It's just what he's done, so we're warned.<br /><br />-BillAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4683970826895755480.post-84213438809694847482014-08-02T12:17:15.035+01:002014-08-02T12:17:15.035+01:00I wonder if the average person is really concerned...I wonder if the average person is really concerned with the existential questions of modernity, or if this is simply a problem for those of us gifted/cursed with a higher IQ and the resulting introspection.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com