tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4683970826895755480.post4724619066671861059..comments2024-03-28T17:33:12.465+00:00Comments on Bruce Charlton's Notions: Conceptualising Heaven (and Hell): salvation- versus theosis-based ChristianityBruce Charltonhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/09615189090601688535noreply@blogger.comBlogger6125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4683970826895755480.post-782585477561243352017-02-15T00:53:11.443+00:002017-02-15T00:53:11.443+00:00Apologies, I meant to write "@Prof. Charlton ...Apologies, I meant to write "@Prof. Charlton and S" at the topChristopher Finchnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4683970826895755480.post-86689826353588281672017-02-15T00:50:46.998+00:002017-02-15T00:50:46.998+00:00This article’s vision of both Heaven and Hell is n...This article’s vision of both Heaven and Hell is not only similar but identical to Catholic ‘official’ theology. In fact, everything written on this blog concerning Salvation in general and the evolution of Reality in particular are contained here, straight from the horse’s mouth:<br /><br />http://www.vatican.va/archive/ccc_css/archive/catechism/p123a12.htm<br /><br />Heaven is a ‘communion of life and love with the Trinity, with the Virgin Mary, the angels and all the blessed’, and at the End of Time, when even the very fabric of the Universe will be renewed, the Blessed will be ‘adopted as sons’ of Christ. Heaven consists in falling ever deeper into a fathomless River of Love. I would like to also add that Heaven is necessarily not an unchanging ‘state’. Although the Divine Essence is immutable, and God’s Love Itself is truly infinite (not a mathematically infinite limiting process such as our feeble, finite minds now conceive of, hence God Himself cannot love us any more than he already does), our active capacity to love is not infinite, and will increase as we progress from Purgatory to Heaven, and perhaps even in Heaven itself.<br /><br />And as love of God always implies love of his creatures, yes, we even continue our good works There: this is precisely why Catholics pray for the Intercession of the Saints. Indeed, Therese of Liesieux beautifully declared ‘I will spend my Heaven by doing good on earth’. Likewise, if there were no ‘progression’ in the afterlife it would be fruitless to pray for the Dead. Though when offering our own speculations on such grave matters, it would seem prudent to recall that “no eye has seen, nor ear heard, nor the heart of man conceived, what God has prepared for those who love him”.<br /><br />I should also point out that when the Catechism mentions we are judged on our works and faith, this does not single out ‘good works’ but speaks in general. So it also includes all those things that we ought to repent. And I completely agree that repentance is the most important thing. Because although God will count our good works against the temporal punishment due to our sins (here and in Purgatory), nonetheless, a man can do all the good works he wants, but if he doesn’t repent of his (inevitable) mortal sins he has made his choice, all the same.<br />Christopher Finchnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4683970826895755480.post-43699914841454760842017-02-12T18:04:52.429+00:002017-02-12T18:04:52.429+00:00Of course, this is why I said, it was similar but ...Of course, this is why I said, it was similar but not the same. In Catholic and Orthodox view the emphasis is not about justification (the forgiveness of sins, which is considered a firsy step) but about santification (theosis). Since santification cannot often be achieved in this life, it must continue after life. For luther and Calvin santification was not possible because man is irremediably corrupt.<br /><br />https://www.firstthings.com/article/2002/04/purgatory-for-everyonesayingthetruthisofensivehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11343116885800383374noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4683970826895755480.post-53645694330083666582017-02-12T17:58:44.929+00:002017-02-12T17:58:44.929+00:00@s - What I am saying isn't the Catholic (eith...@s - What I am saying isn't the Catholic (either Eastern or Western view) - at least not the official theology - but there are indeed similarities, and the Orthodox especially have a big emphasis on theosis. Bruce Charltonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09615189090601688535noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4683970826895755480.post-77321234370114136562017-02-12T17:52:43.304+00:002017-02-12T17:52:43.304+00:00Well what you describe is very similar to Roman Ca...Well what you describe is very similar to Roman Catholicism, with one big difference. What you call Heaven, Roman Catholics call Purgatory, a state where people strive for being more Christ-like until they are ready to be in the presence of God. Then they enter Heaven although I don't know if there is further spiritual progression in Heaven. I think Orthodox Church has the same view, which was the one of the first Christians. Only Protestants disagree.sayingthetruthisofensivehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11343116885800383374noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4683970826895755480.post-9533318181769546252017-02-12T12:05:08.952+00:002017-02-12T12:05:08.952+00:00Acceptance of this would be of the greatest benefi...Acceptance of this would be of the greatest benefit to Christians and non-Christians alike. The former so they could have a deeper understanding of their religion and its purpose, and the latter so they could see that the way of Christ and, in particular, the destination to which it leads is not so simplistic as often presented but has deeper and deeper stages. The many mansions in my Father's house can be seen as representing these stages to theosis from a position of basic salvation to full son or daughter ship. And then even further. Why not? I doubt there is any end to spiritual unfoldment.<br />William Wildbloodhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13231219533755925897noreply@blogger.com